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Magic & Spellcasting
Magic & Spellcasting
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Magic & Spellcasting
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Darvin
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Magic & Spellcasting
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on:
January 25, 2007, 07:22:10 pm »
Passive Mana: your passive mana is determined by your energy stat; it is basically your reserve energy. Even spellcasters with low amounts of energy will have a healthy store; those with a high amount may seem to have a nigh limitless well of power they can draw upon. Passive mana cannot be used directly; it is essentially in storage and must be converted to active mana first. The rate of regeneration of passive mana is proportional to how much you have left; the less passive mana you have left, the faster it regenerates. However, there is a critical caveat to this which will be discussed in "conversion" (below).
Active Mana: this type of mana is literally the magical energy that the spellcaster is actively using. Casting spells drains away at your active mana, and you must delve into your passive mana to regenerate it. There is no absolute maximum amount of active mana a wizard can have, but there is an effective maximum. Active mana is very much the anti-thesis of passive mana; it has a constant degeneration rate, which increases as you gather more. In other words, keep charging up active mana and you lose more and more to "waste". Characters with high control (spirit) and focus (mental) scores can reduce this waste somewhat.
Conversion: the process of converting passive mana to active mana is clearly critical to a spellcaster's strategy. Converting quickly can give you a quick boost in power, but results in a greater degree of wasted energy, and in the long run leaves your passive mana pool depleted. There's another important aspect of converting passive mana to active mana: it is very taxing on your physical endurance. This has a very important implication: a wizard in armour or weilding a sword may exhaust himself too much from spellcasting to effectively use these things, and fighting and wearing armour may exhaust him too much to use spellcasting later. This forces characters who are melee spellcasters to balance their conversion and use their power wisely; it also places a very high emphasis on endurance for such characters. The maximum rate of conversion is limited by how much energy you have left. The less energy left, the less you can convert at a time. Except when your passive mana is nearing zero, you convert considerably faster than passive mana regenerates. This is an important consideration; if your passive mana is reduced to a very low amount, you cannot take advantage of the fact that its regeneration rate has increased until it has had time to recover.
Types of Magic:
Mana is just your fuel source for magic, nothing more. Even the character designed to have the least spellcasting abilities possible will have some mana, but it is the capability to use that mana that will define them as a spellcaster or not. Spellcasting is a tactical art, which requires many considerations and techniques to use effectively.
As mentioned, endurance and energy are your primary attributes with regards to your mana pool (although focus and control count for something, too). However, your primary attributes for actually using magic are control, memory, and creativity. For the most part, memory and creativity are interchangeable. Memory spellcasting involves learning how to form a spell, then repeating the steps meticulously. Creativity spellcasting involves envisioning the end result, and forcing it into reality by sheer willpower. Both cases require control in order to shape the magic. Memory-based spellcasting tends to be more reliable and uniform, and much less error-prone. Creativity based magic is much more adaptable, and easily tailored to a given situation. Neither is inherently superior, nor are they mutually exclusive.
These are the primary classifications of magic I have thought of right now (aside from "enchantment" type magic it seems to cover just about every angle quite accurately), though others may be implemented:
Aura Magic: this is the inescapable consequence of "waste" mana that burns away from a wizard's active mana component. The wizard's aura is usually unnoticeable by the untrained eye in his rest state, but that power can increase dramatically in times of need. However, it is not necessarily wasted; a spellcaster can manipulate his own aura to suit his given purpose. Aura magic is considered wasteful since it inherently is difficult to control and direct, but it can still be shaped into a useful passive effect.
Release Magic: this is as simple as it sounds. You accumulate magic, shape it into a specific form, and then release it. Release magic is somewhat similar to lobbing a grenade. Before you throw it you can gauge distance, force, and even how long before it explodes. Once it leaves your hand, you'd better hope you got those things right, because they can't be changed. Moreover, experienced wizards have ways of throwing that grenade back at you. "Ping-pong" with release magic is not unheard of.
Chain Magic: unlike release magic, chain magic retains a connection to the spellcaster after it has been released (keeping it on a "chain" so to speak). In this way, the spellcaster can continually redirect and control the magic. This comes with extra overhead in terms of concentration, but results in magic that is more difficult to counteract and redirect. Another huge advantage is that "chain" magic can be reinforced and enhanced even after casting. The biggest disadvantage of chain magic is that there are ways to disrupt control.
Field Manipulation: this type of magic is invoked in order to provide a perpetual effect that can be reinforced by the spellcaster's will, as well as modified or redirected at will. Unlike chain magic, this is a self-perpetuating magic field that requires no concentration. For this reason, field manipulations are usually defensive in nature. They serve important auxiliary roles, allowing a spellcaster to modify the field to his likings. The largest weakness of field manipulations is that enemies can overpower them or even hijack them to turn them against you. Magical fields dissipate with time if left unattended.
Spellcasting:
As will be covered in greater detail in another article, spellcasting works much like any other combat techniques, except the goal is to combine many different "aspects" to form a spell. For instance, there is no basic "fireball" ability. Instead, you would take the "fire" aspect, combine it with the "ball projectile" aspect, and throw in the "explosion" aspect for good measure. The result would be a fireball. Even then, you'd have the ability to fine tune its exact specifications in terms of how volitile, powerful, and fast it moves.
However, the point of spellcasting is that you can combine many different aspects to satisfy your needs. Add the "guided" aspect to the fireball described above to dictate the path it will follow. Each aspect that is added increases the complexity of the spell, and makes it more difficult to cast. This is no different than combat techniques, where you might combine a spin attack with a charge up attack to form a charge-up spin attack. As well, it should be noted that magic and combat techniques are not exclusive. Try adding the "fire" magic aspect to a charge up spin attack for interesting results.
«
Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 07:23:47 pm by Darvin
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Solinx
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
«
Reply #1 on:
February 02, 2007, 04:48:42 pm »
The mana system is certainly original, I just hope people won't find it to be too difficult to master. If it's too difficult for the average player, we won't be making the game any more popular.
I don't particulairly like giving negative comments without offering an alternative, it's just that I expect you can make a better alternative if you decide to make one.
The classifications of magic are really good. They come down to a basic form, but then with just a little more to it. Great job, I can see these classifications becoming popular
Certainly combined with the spellcasting system you gave a preview of
Solinx
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Last Edit: February 02, 2007, 04:54:34 pm by Solinx
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"An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
Darvin
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
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Reply #2 on:
February 02, 2007, 08:25:52 pm »
One of the underlying faults I find in most RPG's is that there is no incentive to hold back; you want to use all your energy right away and beat the crap out of the enemy. The strategy to outlast an opponent just doesn't seem to exist. The idea of passive mana (and endurance will have a similar function in the domain of physical combat) is to limit your ability to go all out, and instead give a tactical focus on balancing your output in the long term.
In terms of complexity, at this point I'd like to point out that I've thrown everything on the table, and now it's time to hand-pick what we need. I fully intend to reduce the complexity and make the game more concise, but what will go I'm not certain of. I think, for instance, that creativity and memory will just be passive effects rather than something you need to keep track of.
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Solinx
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
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Reply #3 on:
February 03, 2007, 05:16:03 am »
Yes, most RPG's focus on today rather than tomorrow, sad but true. I really enjoyed playing the areas in NWN where resting was forbidden, it really forced you to use every spell you had to it's best advantage, or you could become toast in melee fights. ^_^
I'm glad that you'll be simplifying some things. If I may say so myself, I do tend to figure out systems very quickly, due to having a pretty good imagination, and while your system is logical and not wierd at any point (as far as magic isn't wierd
), it was quite a lot to remember, a bit too much in my opinion. So it's good to see you're turning some things into passive effects
Solinx
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"An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
Darvin
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
«
Reply #4 on:
February 03, 2007, 07:15:19 am »
I love rest prohibited areas, too, but unfortunately they really favour fighter-type classes. So long as you don't run out of healing kits, you don't need to rest.
In the physical domain, there will only be stamina (there's no equivilent to passive or active energy as far as stamina goes). Stamina is used as you convert passive to active mana (not a concern for non-spellcasters), as you move around (especially in heavy armour), dodge, attack, and use physical combat techniques. However, characters can also build up adrenalin, which passively acts as debit on stamina (exact operation of adrenalin still needs fine tuning, this is just the general concept). As the fight continues, characters can keep building up adrenalin to keep their stamina from collapsing. However, if they try to rest, adrenalin falls and they have to pay back all that "free" stamina they got. Adrenalin has its limits, and certain characters may be better at utilizing it than others. There is one critical problem with adrenalin; if an opponent just keeps evading your attacks and doesn't strike back at all, adrenalin will drop, and if you've built up a heavy debt, you're going to be in trouble. The idea here is that your anger - swinging madly and riding on adrenalin - can be used against you by an opponent who emphasizes self control (that is, if they survive long enough to do so).
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Solinx
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
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Reply #5 on:
February 03, 2007, 04:15:17 pm »
Hmpf, healing kits, health potions... junk for the weaklings. The only time I use them is when I get poisoned. It's much more fun to have a Cleric tag along and be limited to the healing you get from that character.
Edit: I don't think the average player will agree with us tho
A nice implemention of rage btw
Anyone could master it a bit, but you'd really need to focus on it to make it overwhelming.
Solinx
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"An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
Darvin
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
«
Reply #6 on:
February 03, 2007, 10:19:31 pm »
I only use the healing potions I find on my journies, and even then I horde them. The only time I ever bought healing potions in ANY D&D based game was right before the villain mob battle in HotU. Second time through as a pure sorcerer I just vapourized them, but it was FRICKEN HARD with a halfling fighter/rogue.
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Darvin
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
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Reply #7 on:
August 07, 2008, 08:42:46 am »
So, I was coming up with a mathematical model for my active / passive mana idea over my holiday, and I came up with the following formulas that provide a very interesting system.
Code:
Passive Mana Regeneration =
( 8 * ( energy stat ^ 1.25) + 1500 ) / ( passive mana + 100) - 1
Conversion Rate =
passive mana / ( active mana + 50)
Decay Rate =
active mana / ( control stat ^ 1.25)
To refresh your memory, "passive" mana is your long-term battery of energy, while "active" mana is your short-term usable energy supply. Passive mana will regenerate over time (more vigorously if it has been depleted, although this will drain stamina - something I haven't decided how to model mathematically yet), while active mana will siphon passive mana to fuel itself. It should be noted that active mana will decay over time if it is unused. I would like to add that for the purposes of this model, I've bounded stats between the values of 8 and 50 (there are further limitations, as well, which can be found in the threads on character advancement).
Attached is a spreadsheet which demonstrates the formulas. You can (as I did) tinker around with the stats and active/passive mana values to see how the system reacts. The default values I have in place serve to demonstrate the "equilibrium" position for this specific stat placement. Passive mana is regenerating at a rate that is equal to the transfer to active mana, while active mana is decaying at an equal rate. The end result is a stable "resting" value, or the effective maximum mana. By testing different values (actually, I did an algebraic proof, but you can plainly see just be testing values...) you can see that this is a stable equilibrium, and that no matter how extreme the fluctuations of active and passive mana may be (negative values - which are invalid, by the way - not withstanding) they will eventually tend towards this equilibrium.
Won't let me upload anything
While the system may need some tweaking to get the timing and constants right, I think they provide an excellent model for what I set out to do from the beginning. Players don't need to worry about the complex mathematics that take place under the hood, they only need to care about what it does to their character.
It should be added that I fully intend to add abilities that will allow players to manipulate the transfer rate between passive and active mana. These temporary fluctuations will allow more player control over the feature, but shouldn't actually break it. As well, the passive "aura" abilities of the spellcraft domain will be fueled by the wasted "decay" of active mana. This will enable powerful wizards (particularly those with high energy values) to put that to good use.
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Darvin
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Re: Magic & Spellcasting
«
Reply #8 on:
August 16, 2008, 09:18:12 am »
One thing that's been irking me about this system is high-low scenario, where you have high passive mana but low active mana. Low active mana results in low decay rate, while a large difference between passive and active mana results in very fast conversion. The result is obscenely fast regeneration of active mana.
This is, of course, the intended functionality. This allows you to rebound if you're in a tight situation and keeps you from being totally defenseless. The downside is that active mana is drained at an extraordinary rate in this circumstance, and your overall conversation rate will begin to dwindle over time. After numerous simulations, however, I found that "dwindling" didn't happen nearly fast enough. Even a moderate energy character can spam spells for long enough that most battles should have conceivably concluded before feeling serious ramifications.
To this end, I've decided one extra factor is required: a 'tax' on mana conversion. In other words, passive mana actually suffers a greater deduction than active mana receives addition. The rate of this extra loss is based on the rate of conversion. The faster mana is being converted, the higher the % of extra loss. This means those which are perpetually "living on the edge" with high conversion rates will deplete much faster than those who hold back. I'm still trying different approaches to achieve this, one of the problems being that characters with high energy to begin with will naturally have higher conversion rates, even though they may not have lower active mana.
In the meanwhile, I've uploaded my mana tester on the SVN server. The tester I uploaded does not implement any solution to the issue I just described. I'll add that change when I've decided on a specific numerical formula to represent it. In the meantime, feel free to test out the system.
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Last Edit: August 17, 2008, 07:03:14 am by Darvin
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